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station this is houston are you ready

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houston this is station we are ready for

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okay csu radio this is mission control

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houston please call station for a voice

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check check check one two three

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hey i've got you loud and clear from the

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international space station

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hey how are you it's very nice to talk

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to you

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for joining us could you tell us where

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are you in the space station right now

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yeah so i'm in the u.s laboratory this

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is just about the

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center forward part of the space station

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and as you can tell it's absolutely a

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working laboratory we have experiments

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all over the place

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that's really what we spend a lot of

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time on in microgravity is doing all

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kinds of scientific experiments and so

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the different thing about this

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laboratory is instead of just having

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experiments on the benches you have it

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on the walls and the ceiling as well you

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can see that everywhere

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absolutely

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so what will you be doing today is this

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a typical day for you and and what does

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yeah a typical day in space is pretty

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much anything and everything i'm going

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to be doing an experiment right after we

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finish chatting actually to

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try to understand how fluids move around

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in tubes up here

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so one of the really fascinating things

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in microgravity is that fluids are no

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longer subjected to the force of of

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gravity pulling them down so they form

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balls

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they float

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and we do have things like surface

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tension that still take over as dominant

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variables and so we're going to take a

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look at some modern molecular biology

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tools and try to understand how fluids

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are behaving in this weightless

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environment

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i see i see

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we're very interested in the the

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experiments that you've been conducting

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and the science that goes on i wonder

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first if we could just get a little bit

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of

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information from you about your own path

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to becoming an astronaut your your

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training was in microbiology what

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motivated you to pursue astronaut

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yeah so it's um you know i always say

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that that astronaut training is not

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something that you find

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it really it's

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are you

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just lucky enough eventually to be

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chosen for this there's a lot of people

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that want to do this job and

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it's a little bit i think like winning

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the lottery some days to get the chance

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to leave the planet i have always wanted

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to be a scientist and i was pretty

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solidly working towards that as a career

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i did my graduate studies at stanford

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and then had a lab at the white house

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institute at mit and decided to apply

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for

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astronaut applications

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because it was something i wanted to do

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ever since i was a small child but

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doesn't really seem to fit in that

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completely realistic career

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possibility path

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i think the lesson is take a chance and

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and see what you can find you never know

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where you're going to end up

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right

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so you've been in space now

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three months

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we're wondering what has been easier

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than you expected and what has been

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so it actually was a lot harder when i

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first got up here just to learn how to

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move around and stabilize yourself

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the mission control folks kind of joke

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when you get new astronauts on board

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that they end up crawling on the floor

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of the space station and i thought well

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i'm not going to be a crawler and

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it turns out in your first few weeks you

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cannot move yourself from one place the

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other because the space station is in

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free fall you're in free fall um this is

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not something that you've ever had in

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your human experience and it's a little

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bit like learning how to walk again

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you end up

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at some point you get you get pretty

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good motion control so i can i can

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control now with my fingertips so i can

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float here um i'm sitting in the middle

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of the module or i use my feet a lot to

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move myself around uh you end up being

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sometimes uh you're kind of hanging

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and uh we're learning how to do all of

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that so that was harder some of the

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things that have been easier than

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expected were a lot of the things that

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we've been just training for years so

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things like robotic operations and eva

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all of our science experiments none of

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those are easy but they are familiar

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territory i think it's something that

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nasa's job in preparing the astronauts

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how to train and how to fly

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right

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so let's talk about one of those

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experiments which really was a milestone

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for the first time

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you successfully sequenced dna in a

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spacecraft

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so two questions one why is it so

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difficult to do that and why has it

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taken this long to do it and what are

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the implications of being able to do it

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yeah there's a there's a couple reasons

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that this is really critical one is that

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we're testing out the ability to do

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really remote science

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and

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planet uh this is important actually for

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earth i used to work in the democratic

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republic of congo i worked on monkey pox

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and

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also spent a number of years working on

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ebola we've we've had outbreaks of both

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of these diseases the ability to rapidly

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determine viral sequence in a setting

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where you have no power grid

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almost no internet communication no

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infrastructure whatsoever if you can

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overcome those kinds of engineering

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challenges in order to send something to

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the space station

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it is very adaptable to these sorts of

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remote locations on the planet the other

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reason we want to start doing that is to

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understand

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how sequencing works off the planet and

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i i mentioned about fluids behaving

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they behave in very unexpected ways up

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here

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just

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basic things

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like pushing fluid out of a drink bag

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will be

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an amazing property that i have never

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seen

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liquids behave in that way on earth so

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it's not

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completely well understood how the

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liquids were going to behave

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in a fluidic system needed for

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sequencing uh it's also not completely

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understood

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if this was even going to work at all

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it's actually a pretty complex set of

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experiments to get this up here and then

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to get the data back down to earth so we

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have proven that that we can use this

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technology in microgravity

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now really the world of

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sequencing and molecular biology has

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opened up to us on a space station so we

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can use this to do real-time analysis

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of things like the microbiome on the

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space station

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cellular function and structure in orbit

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you can imagine if cells are in free

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fall

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rather than sitting at the bottom of a

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plastic dish their function may be

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greatly affected their structure may be

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affected we can study all of those

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types of things with modern molecular

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biology tools the first thing is you

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have to show that this can work off the

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thank you

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now in august

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you conducted your first spacewalk

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is there any possible way that you can

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try to help our listener

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that's pretty hard because i didn't even

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have a very good understanding of that

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myself before i went out the door and i

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worked at nasa and trained

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in a giant pool underwater for seven

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years first

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so it is um i would say more awesome

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amazing and terrifying than you can

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possibly imagine to be in the vacuum of

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space in a spacesuit

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the

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was

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that our spacesuits function like their

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own spacecraft and they have

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systems that report to us

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we have teams of folks on the ground

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that are watching you in your spacesuit

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perform this really critical work we

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installed the international docking

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adapter to the front of space station we

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retracted a radiator and reduced some of

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our risk for orbital debris

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and one thing

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that folks may be really interested in

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is some high definition cameras so we

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can actually get some incredible views

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of the planet and the space station so

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all these tasks were

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they were really important and they're

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it's absolutely critical to execute that

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right

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so you're balancing uh doing a perfect

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job

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and

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also looking at the planet through

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nothing but your visor and trying to

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just take it all in and think how

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amazing it is

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that you're floating in space hanging on

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to the edge of the international space

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extraordinary

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the space station now has been

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occupied continuously for

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15 years almost 16 years

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can you characterize for us just in a

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nutshell why is the space station still

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i think the um

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simple one sentence answer is this is

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the only laboratory where we can study

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microgravity as a variable

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the other really unique thing about

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space station is the radiation

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environment we can't perform these some

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of these experiments on earth

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we have for example beams that will take

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a look at one specific heavy particle of

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radiation but we can't simulate right

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now the complex

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radiation environment in low earth orbit

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as you get farther into space

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and are less protected by earth's

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magnetic fields you're subject to even

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more and more radiation so it's

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interesting

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health performance and exploration

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standpoint it's really interesting for

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people on earth because we are

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understanding and making new discoveries

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about fundamental

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biological

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material science

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aspects of things

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some of these experiments we just can't

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do on the planet so this laboratory has

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been operated and staffed for an

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incredible number of years

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and there is still an incredible number

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one last question

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you'll be back on earth

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soon

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well i'm really looking forward to uh

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landing

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seeing the sun a little bit feeling the

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uh feel of of wind

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there's a lot of things when you

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are not on the planet you don't know

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that you would miss them

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and when you suddenly move to a closed

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loop

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completely i would say isolated

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environment

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being on the planet sometimes sounds

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pretty good in terms of being able to

293
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experience even things like rain that

294
00:11:46,230 --> 00:11:43,760
you might take for granted and be

295
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annoyed that you're in a rain storm

296
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you know think about astronauts who

297
00:11:51,350 --> 00:11:49,680
don't get rain for quite a few months i

298
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think everything

299
00:11:55,430 --> 00:11:52,320
that

300
00:11:58,150 --> 00:11:55,440
feels like being outside sounds very

301
00:12:03,509 --> 00:12:00,230
station this is houston acr that

302
00:12:05,829 --> 00:12:03,519
concludes the kzsu radio portion of the

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00:12:07,990 --> 00:12:05,839
event please stand by for a voice check

304
00:12:10,069 --> 00:12:08,000
from npr

305
00:12:13,269 --> 00:12:10,079
station this is ray bichell with npr how

306
00:12:16,550 --> 00:12:14,710
i've got you loud and clear it's great

307
00:12:19,509 --> 00:12:16,560
to be talking to you today

308
00:12:20,870 --> 00:12:19,519
yeah you too thanks so much

309
00:12:22,790 --> 00:12:20,880
so i'm gonna

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00:12:25,190 --> 00:12:22,800
just fire off the questions here because

311
00:12:27,430 --> 00:12:25,200
we got 10 minutes

312
00:12:29,590 --> 00:12:27,440
um first one up how many days have you

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00:12:31,430 --> 00:12:29,600
been in space now um and you mentioned

314
00:12:33,030 --> 00:12:31,440
that you're you're floating for people

315
00:12:35,190 --> 00:12:33,040
who can't see you

316
00:12:40,230 --> 00:12:35,200
where you are what

317
00:12:44,389 --> 00:12:42,230
so i've been in space we uh we have a

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00:12:46,629 --> 00:12:44,399
party when we're in space uh for a

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00:12:48,310 --> 00:12:46,639
hundred days due to the timing of some

320
00:12:49,829 --> 00:12:48,320
of our launches down the road we're

321
00:12:51,990 --> 00:12:49,839
actually having the party not at 100

322
00:12:54,389 --> 00:12:52,000
days but about 90 days so we're coming

323
00:12:57,190 --> 00:12:54,399
up on 90 days soon that's how i keep

324
00:13:00,069 --> 00:12:57,200
track of time up here and i am floating

325
00:13:02,150 --> 00:13:00,079
right now uh i i mentioned that we are

326
00:13:03,910 --> 00:13:02,160
we're in free fall so the space station

327
00:13:04,870 --> 00:13:03,920
is falling around the earth i'm falling

328
00:13:07,509 --> 00:13:04,880
with it

329
00:13:09,910 --> 00:13:07,519
i can create some local acceleration

330
00:13:12,550 --> 00:13:09,920
here but right now i'm floating in the

331
00:13:14,230 --> 00:13:12,560
middle of the u.s laboratory which is

332
00:13:16,949 --> 00:13:14,240
just about in the center of the space

333
00:13:19,190 --> 00:13:16,959
station and is really our nerve center

334
00:13:21,990 --> 00:13:19,200
it's our epicenter for scientific

335
00:13:24,470 --> 00:13:22,000
investigations uh in this in this space

336
00:13:27,269 --> 00:13:24,480
station which is i have to say enormous

337
00:13:28,710 --> 00:13:27,279
i mean it's the size of a 747 it's it's

338
00:13:31,030 --> 00:13:28,720
far bigger

339
00:13:34,389 --> 00:13:31,040
and more impressive than i expected in

340
00:13:35,829 --> 00:13:34,399
my years of working at nasa

341
00:13:38,150 --> 00:13:35,839
gotcha

342
00:13:39,750 --> 00:13:38,160
what moments during your time on the iss

343
00:13:45,269 --> 00:13:39,760
have made you

344
00:13:50,310 --> 00:13:48,389
that is a great question because

345
00:13:52,870 --> 00:13:50,320
gasping out loud is actually the

346
00:13:55,750 --> 00:13:52,880
reaction you have quite a bit there's a

347
00:13:57,670 --> 00:13:55,760
lot of things up here that

348
00:13:59,350 --> 00:13:57,680
you've just never seen in your human

349
00:14:02,550 --> 00:13:59,360
experience before

350
00:14:03,509 --> 00:14:02,560
there's things that uh you know in

351
00:14:06,310 --> 00:14:03,519
theory

352
00:14:08,629 --> 00:14:06,320
but have never actually witnessed

353
00:14:10,949 --> 00:14:08,639
and uh when you when you encounter those

354
00:14:12,870 --> 00:14:10,959
kinds of phenomenon it really just makes

355
00:14:14,629 --> 00:14:12,880
your jaw drop so i'd never seen the

356
00:14:18,550 --> 00:14:14,639
aurora before

357
00:14:20,710 --> 00:14:18,560
i'm from california fairly low latitude

358
00:14:23,750 --> 00:14:20,720
and uh never seen the aurora from the

359
00:14:26,870 --> 00:14:23,760
planet uh so when i saw the aurora for

360
00:14:28,230 --> 00:14:26,880
the first time over the entire globe i

361
00:14:30,389 --> 00:14:28,240
almost couldn't talk for a couple

362
00:14:31,990 --> 00:14:30,399
minutes it was so fantastic i had a

363
00:14:34,710 --> 00:14:32,000
wonderful

364
00:14:36,790 --> 00:14:34,720
sighting the other day

365
00:14:39,509 --> 00:14:36,800
some very complicated

366
00:14:41,350 --> 00:14:39,519
rules about orbital motion and what beta

367
00:14:42,629 --> 00:14:41,360
angle you're at but i was able to see

368
00:14:44,550 --> 00:14:42,639
the moon

369
00:14:46,949 --> 00:14:44,560
while we're on the space station

370
00:14:48,790 --> 00:14:46,959
uh so we were in the in dark and the

371
00:14:50,150 --> 00:14:48,800
moon was lit by the sun i couldn't see

372
00:14:52,069 --> 00:14:50,160
the sun the sun was on the other side of

373
00:14:54,629 --> 00:14:52,079
the planet um

374
00:14:57,670 --> 00:14:54,639
so it it actually

375
00:15:00,629 --> 00:14:57,680
showed me planetary motion uh

376
00:15:03,030 --> 00:15:00,639
obviously i believe that kepler is right

377
00:15:05,110 --> 00:15:03,040
but to see that kind of thing really

378
00:15:07,910 --> 00:15:05,120
makes your jaw drop

379
00:15:10,069 --> 00:15:07,920
hmm okay and um can you tell me a little

380
00:15:11,990 --> 00:15:10,079
bit more about the heart cells the stem

381
00:15:15,269 --> 00:15:12,000
cells that you grew what was that like

382
00:15:19,670 --> 00:15:17,350
yeah absolutely that was an experiment

383
00:15:22,949 --> 00:15:19,680
out of the cardiology lab at stanford

384
00:15:26,629 --> 00:15:22,959
and their goal was to use programmed

385
00:15:28,230 --> 00:15:26,639
adult stem cells so ips cells that are

386
00:15:32,550 --> 00:15:28,240
that are

387
00:15:34,790 --> 00:15:32,560
be heart cells cardiomyocytes

388
00:15:38,069 --> 00:15:34,800
and see if we could grow those on orbit

389
00:15:41,189 --> 00:15:38,079
and how microgravity might affect

390
00:15:43,189 --> 00:15:41,199
the cellular organization the structure

391
00:15:45,590 --> 00:15:43,199
and the function so part of it was a

392
00:15:47,269 --> 00:15:45,600
technical challenge can we launch cells

393
00:15:49,269 --> 00:15:47,279
ins into space

394
00:15:52,310 --> 00:15:49,279
grow them in culture for a long period

395
00:15:54,150 --> 00:15:52,320
of time and then return them to earth uh

396
00:15:55,509 --> 00:15:54,160
that was a pretty incredible experience

397
00:15:57,749 --> 00:15:55,519
i've done a lot of cell culture in my

398
00:16:00,790 --> 00:15:57,759
life there's something about seeing

399
00:16:04,069 --> 00:16:00,800
beating heart cells in space that was

400
00:16:06,310 --> 00:16:04,079
very uh inspiring and i think really

401
00:16:09,749 --> 00:16:06,320
speaks to the scientific potential of

402
00:16:11,509 --> 00:16:09,759
space station as a laboratory

403
00:16:14,389 --> 00:16:11,519
i'm curious to know how has being in

404
00:16:19,030 --> 00:16:14,399
space made you think differently about

405
00:16:23,430 --> 00:16:21,430
the physiology is incredibly changed up

406
00:16:26,069 --> 00:16:23,440
here and that's a really interesting

407
00:16:28,470 --> 00:16:26,079
thing to see firsthand so one of the

408
00:16:30,150 --> 00:16:28,480
things that changes is on the planet

409
00:16:32,710 --> 00:16:30,160
when you're walking around in your daily

410
00:16:34,790 --> 00:16:32,720
life all of your blood is drawn by the

411
00:16:37,509 --> 00:16:34,800
force of gravity down into your feet and

412
00:16:38,710 --> 00:16:37,519
your legs and humans have evolved uh

413
00:16:40,629 --> 00:16:38,720
with this

414
00:16:42,949 --> 00:16:40,639
constant force of gravity so that's how

415
00:16:44,710 --> 00:16:42,959
our physiology has evolved

416
00:16:46,870 --> 00:16:44,720
when all of a sudden we build rockets

417
00:16:48,710 --> 00:16:46,880
and send people into space which is

418
00:16:51,990 --> 00:16:48,720
quite unexpected from an evolutionary

419
00:16:54,310 --> 00:16:52,000
perspective that fluid then shifts up to

420
00:16:56,470 --> 00:16:54,320
your head so you actually lose a lot of

421
00:16:58,550 --> 00:16:56,480
your blood plasma volume

422
00:17:00,310 --> 00:16:58,560
it's better in space to have slightly

423
00:17:03,350 --> 00:17:00,320
less blood volume that's what

424
00:17:05,669 --> 00:17:03,360
homeostasis is up here and

425
00:17:07,350 --> 00:17:05,679
you do get this feeling of head fullness

426
00:17:08,949 --> 00:17:07,360
sort of like you're hanging upside down

427
00:17:10,870 --> 00:17:08,959
off the end of your bed that never

428
00:17:12,710 --> 00:17:10,880
completely goes away

429
00:17:15,350 --> 00:17:12,720
there's some really interesting effects

430
00:17:18,150 --> 00:17:15,360
that we're studying on arterial function

431
00:17:21,189 --> 00:17:18,160
we have a slightly high higher exposure

432
00:17:22,630 --> 00:17:21,199
to constant levels of co2 up here and

433
00:17:24,710 --> 00:17:22,640
we're living in a closed-loop

434
00:17:26,230 --> 00:17:24,720
environment so we recycle all of our air

435
00:17:28,789 --> 00:17:26,240
in our water all of those things have

436
00:17:30,830 --> 00:17:28,799
profound physiology effects and we're

437
00:17:33,270 --> 00:17:30,840
participating in about 200 different

438
00:17:35,590 --> 00:17:33,280
experiments to analyze all of those

439
00:17:38,230 --> 00:17:35,600
effects on the human body

440
00:17:40,549 --> 00:17:38,240
does it make you feel like your body is

441
00:17:43,990 --> 00:17:40,559
stronger or weaker than than it felt on

442
00:17:48,390 --> 00:17:45,510
well one of the things we get to do up

443
00:17:50,070 --> 00:17:48,400
here is uh weightlifting so we can't

444
00:17:52,950 --> 00:17:50,080
actually lifts weights there's there's

445
00:17:56,390 --> 00:17:52,960
no weight here just mass we work against

446
00:17:58,710 --> 00:17:56,400
vacuum and uh i have set a few records

447
00:18:01,750 --> 00:17:58,720
that are higher than i can lift on earth

448
00:18:02,710 --> 00:18:01,760
so i think overall the time we spend

449
00:18:05,190 --> 00:18:02,720
actually

450
00:18:07,510 --> 00:18:05,200
making sure astronauts stay healthy

451
00:18:09,750 --> 00:18:07,520
is incredible contribution towards

452
00:18:11,350 --> 00:18:09,760
maintaining our physiology and i would

453
00:18:13,990 --> 00:18:11,360
say i'm right now i'm a little stronger

454
00:18:15,190 --> 00:18:14,000
in space than i am on the planet

455
00:18:18,310 --> 00:18:15,200
okay cool

456
00:18:21,029 --> 00:18:18,320
um so as a biologist on earth you were

457
00:18:23,750 --> 00:18:21,039
studying some really nasty viruses

458
00:18:26,549 --> 00:18:23,760
um what was motivating your work on

459
00:18:32,870 --> 00:18:26,559
earth uh and i'm interested to know what

460
00:18:37,669 --> 00:18:34,870
yeah so on earth i started out in

461
00:18:39,029 --> 00:18:37,679
undergraduate on hiv actually and i was

462
00:18:40,150 --> 00:18:39,039
interested in that from a public health

463
00:18:42,310 --> 00:18:40,160
perspective

464
00:18:44,470 --> 00:18:42,320
at first and then got very interested in

465
00:18:46,630 --> 00:18:44,480
the virology and

466
00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:46,640
where hiv integrates in the genome and

467
00:18:51,510 --> 00:18:48,000
potentially

468
00:18:52,549 --> 00:18:51,520
drugs to treat hiv infection

469
00:18:54,070 --> 00:18:52,559
from there

470
00:18:56,310 --> 00:18:54,080
i promised my mom i would work on a

471
00:18:59,590 --> 00:18:56,320
different virus and fortunately i chose

472
00:19:02,230 --> 00:18:59,600
ebola and monkey pox and smallpox

473
00:19:05,830 --> 00:19:02,240
the interest there is trying to

474
00:19:07,750 --> 00:19:05,840
understand how the virus and

475
00:19:10,230 --> 00:19:07,760
the human genome interact

476
00:19:11,990 --> 00:19:10,240
what we might do to prevent future

477
00:19:15,190 --> 00:19:12,000
outbreaks

478
00:19:17,990 --> 00:19:15,200
what is it about viruses that can

479
00:19:20,390 --> 00:19:18,000
come in and cause such lethal infections

480
00:19:22,710 --> 00:19:20,400
to humans so we're obviously not working

481
00:19:24,390 --> 00:19:22,720
on any of those kinds of viruses up here

482
00:19:26,070 --> 00:19:24,400
on the space station but the sorts of

483
00:19:28,710 --> 00:19:26,080
techniques that we would use for example

484
00:19:31,590 --> 00:19:28,720
the the whole genome sequencing

485
00:19:33,909 --> 00:19:31,600
any kind of pcr molecular techniques

486
00:19:36,070 --> 00:19:33,919
looking at gene expression looking at

487
00:19:38,470 --> 00:19:36,080
cellular structure all of those are

488
00:19:40,470 --> 00:19:38,480
things that we use on the space station

489
00:19:43,110 --> 00:19:40,480
to try to understand

490
00:19:45,190 --> 00:19:43,120
a different variable here and that is

491
00:19:48,470 --> 00:19:45,200
human physiology in space

492
00:19:50,789 --> 00:19:48,480
cellular function and structure in

493
00:19:53,029 --> 00:19:50,799
microgravity and the radiation effects

494
00:19:55,590 --> 00:19:53,039
on orbit

495
00:19:57,029 --> 00:19:55,600
so in all these experiments i mean

496
00:20:00,150 --> 00:19:57,039
understanding how medicine works in

497
00:20:01,669 --> 00:20:00,160
space how heart cells hold up

498
00:20:03,590 --> 00:20:01,679
what is

499
00:20:05,590 --> 00:20:03,600
who who are you thinking in the back of

500
00:20:07,270 --> 00:20:05,600
your head will benefit from this is it

501
00:20:09,830 --> 00:20:07,280
people on earth

502
00:20:12,630 --> 00:20:09,840
or is it people who would be

503
00:20:17,190 --> 00:20:12,640
in the future living in space or on a

504
00:20:21,270 --> 00:20:19,909
i think the answer is both uh

505
00:20:22,630 --> 00:20:21,280
these experiments there's a lot of

506
00:20:23,990 --> 00:20:22,640
experiments here obviously that nasa

507
00:20:26,390 --> 00:20:24,000
does because they're interested in

508
00:20:27,830 --> 00:20:26,400
exploration we're going beyond low earth

509
00:20:29,590 --> 00:20:27,840
orbit

510
00:20:32,310 --> 00:20:29,600
we have to start somewhere in terms of

511
00:20:34,070 --> 00:20:32,320
of understanding what happens to human

512
00:20:36,070 --> 00:20:34,080
beings long term in space and we've been

513
00:20:37,669 --> 00:20:36,080
doing a lot of those experiments there's

514
00:20:39,750 --> 00:20:37,679
a whole lot more

515
00:20:41,830 --> 00:20:39,760
left to learn i'm surprised by the

516
00:20:43,430 --> 00:20:41,840
physiology every day